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  • BMW 123d M-Sport

    Nov 14, 2007 1:15 PM

    Diminutive sports coupés infused with quality engineering: vehicles like these form the bedrock of BMW’s revered tradition, and with the new 1-series coupé, the firm seeks a return to a sporting ethos it believes will produce the lowest average owner age profile of any car it currently makes.


    Which explains why BMW is so eager to associate the 1-series coupé with the sports saloon/coupé models of the late ’60s and early ’70s, particularly the much-loved 2002 tii and 2002 turbo models....Read the full article

    • oaffie
    • Joined Nov 14, 2007
    • 33 Posts
    • Status: Offline

    Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Nov 14, 2007 1:26 PM

    I don't see why anyone would buy this particular model (the Coupe) over the 3 door model with the same engine.  The 3 door is more practical, looks better, still has the pillar-less doors...  Not only that but get it in SE spec and it's also considerably cheaper for the same brilliant engine and handling.

    As soon as I pass my exams and qualify as an Accountant I shall be purchasing a 3 door 123d and enjoy all the benefits for a lot less money.  The Germans seem to be so good at selling us (the British in particular) less car for more money.  Hence the reason the M6 costs about £20k more than an M5 and for what, seeing as they share so many components under the body? 

  • Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Nov 16, 2007 12:41 AM

    I ordered my 123D SE 3dr a couple of weeks ago and feel many of the strengths of the Coupe are present on the Hatchback. Having driven the pre and post facelift 1 series, it felt to me that the latest version rides a lot better. Whether this is down to the latest run-flats or BMW tweaking behind the scenes I know not, but I do think it is slightly unfair that the Hatch gets marked down so readily for general ride comfort compared to the Coupe. The Hatch is firm, no doubt and this is one of the reasons I went for the SE over the M version, but I felt my budget wouldn’t stretch to an ‘M’ and a Chiropractor (kidding).   Most of the strengths and weakness are present in both Hatch and Coupe, the ‘full fat’ M steering wheel for instance, is designed for virtuoso Violinists and there is bugger all room in the back, but oh that engine. I noticed too that the gearing is slightly shorter on the 123D over the 120D, guess that will emphasise the performance differential. But if I am honest, I bought the Hatch as a mini GT. It has enough space (just) and versatility covers the ground quickly and quietly and at least, thanks to Mr Bangle, it looks distinctive.  One thing that disappointed me though, was the Stop Start, as the Diesel does shudder into life when starting. I don’t expect the engine to start up like an electric motor, but the high compression motor doesn’t half let you know it’s coming to life.

     

  • Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Nov 16, 2007 1:59 PM

    oaffie:
    The 3 door is more practical

    Really depends on your definition of practical I suppose.  The coupe is a slightly larger car, 12cm longer than the three-door, and comes with 40 litres more boot space - how beneficial that is depends on the configuration, of course, and what you intend to lug about in your shiney new car - beyond the weekly shop.

    The coupe is a proper four seater, in that it doesn't have the compromised rear bench with pads and seatbelts for three that the the 3/5 door has.  Neither would actually be very comfortable for three rear passengers but if I found myself in the back of one I'd rather have a nicely formed seat than an upholstered hump.

    If practicality is what you're after then an A3 might be a better buy (though far more dull! My wife has one - I know!)

    As for the price difference, in SE trim the coupe comes out £1090 more.  Not sure if there are any equipment/technical differences between them, but most manufacturers put a premium on coupe/cabrio, BMW are no different here, and I think the coupe is a better looking car (though the 3-door is somewhat reminiscent of the marvellous M Coupe), but for my money the forthcoming cabriolet beats them all, and I'll be ordering one, if it ever comes with the twin-turbo 2.0d.

     

  • Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Nov 17, 2007 3:09 AM

    The Colonel:
    Really depends on your definition of practical I suppose.  The coupe is a slightly larger car, 12cm longer than the three-door, and comes with 40 litres more boot space - how beneficial that is depends on the configuration, of course, and what you intend to lug about in your shiney new car - beyond the weekly shop.

     

     

    I have owned 3 VAG diesels to date and think at my price point, a 4 cylinder Diesel is all I can afford in either VAG or BMW stables. But at least in terms of engines, the VAG 2.0 litre Diesel engines are in a different league to the BMW engines and I don’t mean the division above.  The weekly shop isn’t a premium concern, but getting my technical equipment for my job or squeezing my Road Bike into the boot is, therefore the Coupe is a non starter and the VAG stable can’t put a smile on my face either. So the BMW has chosen itself really. The customer service so far has been exemplary and far exceeds anything I have received from any VAG garage over the last 7 years. I hope the shineyness of the whole experience doesn’t dim with time, even doing the mundane ‘weekly shop’.

     

    • Frawls
    • Joined Nov 07, 2007
    • 10 Posts
    • Status: Offline

    Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Nov 23, 2007 5:53 PM

    As soon as this engine is installed in the 3 series saloon and coupe that will be the end of the 123d coupe. The 123d is just too heavy and expensive relative to the 3 series saloon and coupe. Also a simple Upsolute or Revo remap of the latest 2.0 d engine from BMW will produce the same power and torque figures for a modest three or four hundred pounds so why waste your money on the 123d!

     Get a 320 cd and have it remapped and enjoy a better looking, bigger, better car which is just as fast for less money. You know it makes sense!

     
    Frawls
     

     

     

    • Kee Law
    • Joined Oct 28, 2007
    • 690 Posts
    • Status: Offline

    Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Nov 24, 2007 4:42 PM

    Interesting theory sprung to mind from your post Frawls about the lethargy in which BMW are releasing their efficient dynamics packages and revised engines across their range.  I suppose most manufacturers do this though to avoid undue competition between the cars in their range (e.g. witness the 911 vs. Cayman lack of engine sharing)

    With respect to the aftermarket tuning, for me I prefer to keep cars standard, as they were intended to be by the manufacturers.  This is for many reasons:

    1, maintain warranty

    2, protect resale (mods suggest someone who rags their car (true or not))

    3, excess power may exceed the limits of other compenents

    Bring it!!
  • Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Nov 26, 2007 11:08 AM

    Bearing in mind the 3 series already has the 325d (at 197hp) it's unlikely that the introduction of a 323d will happen, rather the 325d will probably find an uplift in power.

    In any case, it doesn't seem to have stopped BMW introducing a 123d, which is likely to be a big seller, and the current or revised 325d is not likely to be "the end of the 123d coupe", as not all people want the same thing.

    Kee Law:
    With respect to the aftermarket tuning, for me I prefer to keep cars standard,

    Likewise.  Also insurance companies by-and-large don't like re-maps.  Yes there are some firms out there that make a point of providing cover for re-mapped cars, but at some cost.

  • Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Dec 02, 2007 1:27 PM

    Even though the road test was for the Coupe version, I think the 123d 3dr is the first official 200 BHP Diesel "Hot Hatch" (unlike the Thurlby Astra T9).

    Which is pretty significant IMO

    • Berol
    • Joined Nov 29, 2007
    • 26 Posts
    • Status: Offline

    Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Dec 03, 2007 1:19 AM

    I'm sure the BMW twin turbo four is the best four cylinder deisel engine in the world and that before long every other manufacturer will be trying to copy it,just like they do the cars.

    I am also sure it will be available in everything,probably even a seven series in some markets.

    Its cheaper to make than a six,and lighter,you see.

    Its just,well,when this engine first became commonish knowledge in the industry,an old chum who works on the oil side rang me and reminded me that this is the very engine we designed over a weekend thirteen years ago,furthermore the only thing not available then was a common rail pump which could produce the necessary pressure,or nobody was admitting it if there was.

    If we just look at the somewhat prosaic twin turbo bit,what on earth took them so long?

    I mean,we have all been wailing about under 2000 rpm lethargy in deisels for half a century it seems,and the answer has always been to develop the forced induction.

    I thought then,and still do that a simple engine driven blower would be best at the lower rpm range,like the VW petrols use.

    There is absolutely nothing new here,even the electronics are nothing much,and I'm even unsure about the switching between the blowers,but I can't,of course,get any detail on this!

    I freely admit I have it in for car manufacturers,I think they bring most of their problems upon themselves and we pay for the bungling incompetence.

    I hope the above explains why I think that.

    Robin

    • Kee Law
    • Joined Oct 28, 2007
    • 690 Posts
    • Status: Offline

    Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Dec 04, 2007 8:04 PM

    Aren't BMW late to the party because in recent history they had shunned diesels. 

    Since their entry into the market however its fair to say that they've been at or around the leading edge.  your argument would be more fairly directed at say the french manufacturers who have been doing diesels for longer and were considered the leaders...

    This may not be anything new, but what's your point?  Surely better late than never?

     

    Bring it!!
  • Re: BMW 123d M-Sport

    Feb 08, 2008 8:34 PM

    I drove a 1 Series hatch (1.8) last year and the quality of the interior was astounding, the drive lovely and tight, typical tuetonic values throughout, very impressed. However I really think BMW's pricing policy is a tad too arrogant (way too high).. and even as a long term BMW fan this coupe makes me winch.. there's something 'wrong' about it!!

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